Evaluation of skills evaluation!

[Deleted]

Ok, I'm coming to the end of the 13 week beginner non equipped cycle, and am stuck at where to go next. I want to stay with sheiko. I keep getting told "if what you're doing is working, stick with it", however, I feel a different sheiko cycle is needed.


I have not yet completed the whole 13 weeks, so I realise I still have a fair bit of deloading to do. I'm currently around the 11th-12th week, Ive completed my 95% skills evaluation, and this is what has promoted me to start this thread.


Squat is going strong, the 95% flew up, and so I definitely think there are some decent gains to be seen when I do the real skills evaluation.

Bench also went well, however, my bench RM was not paused, and since starting sheiko, I have paused all my bench reps. Therefore, I think that the new RM will be an increase, but not as significant because I am now pausing, which is undoubtedly harder than touch and go. My 95% paused went up well.

Deadlift is where I'm unsure. My 95% went up slow, no signs of any increase, hopefully ill be able to draw a few kg's out of it but we'll see. I really think I need to do something different from 13week beginner cycle, to make it move.


So, what would you all recommend my next move be? I don't really want to approach the beginner cycle again, for the reasons regarding to deadlift. I have read that 29 is a deadlift specialisation cycle? If anyone could point me in the right direction it would be greatly appreciated.

I also contemplated about giving Wendlers 5/3/1 a shot, but after thinking about it, I'd like to stay with sheiko. I love the volume, I love the 3 days a week, and I know that volume works for me, especially in the case of squatting.

Of course, I havn't deloaded completley and tried my new 1rms, so I won't know the full extent until then, and so, I will keep this thread updated as and when those RMs come in.


Sorry for rambling, but you're the experts, and your opinion is best!

crouchmagic

[deathevocation]

Interesting comment regarding the deadlift, I recently completed a long training cycle and my deadlift completely stalled though my squat and bench went up. See how you go when you test your maxes.

[michael]

Jan 2, 2010 5:20:09 GMT -5 @crouchmagic said:

Ok, I'm coming to the end of the 13 week beginner non equipped cycle, and am stuck at where to go next. I want to stay with sheiko. I keep getting told "if what you're doing is working, stick with it", however, I feel a different sheiko cycle is needed.


I have not yet completed the whole 13 weeks, so I realise I still have a fair bit of deloading to do. I'm currently around the 11th-12th week, Ive completed my 95% skills evaluation, and this is what has promoted me to start this thread.


Squat is going strong, the 95% flew up, and so I definitely think there are some decent gains to be seen when I do the real skills evaluation.

Bench also went well, however, my bench RM was not paused, and since starting sheiko, I have paused all my bench reps. Therefore, I think that the new RM will be an increase, but not as significant because I am now pausing, which is undoubtedly harder than touch and go. My 95% paused went up well.

Deadlift is where I'm unsure. My 95% went up slow, no signs of any increase, hopefully ill be able to draw a few kg's out of it but we'll see. I really think I need to do something different from 13week beginner cycle, to make it move.


So, what would you all recommend my next move be? I don't really want to approach the beginner cycle again, for the reasons regarding to deadlift. I have read that 29 is a deadlift specialisation cycle? If anyone could point me in the right direction it would be greatly appreciated.

I also contemplated about giving Wendlers 5/3/1 a shot, but after thinking about it, I'd like to stay with sheiko. I love the volume, I love the 3 days a week, and I know that volume works for me, especially in the case of squatting.

Of course, I havn't deloaded completley and tried my new 1rms, so I won't know the full extent until then, and so, I will keep this thread updated as and when those RMs come in.


Sorry for rambling, but you're the experts, and your opinion is best!

crouchmagic
I feel the exact same way. I have always had more success when pulling from the floor every week. I did 531 for the last 6 months this year and I hit my 405 squat and 600 dead raw at 165. I have been thinking of keeping most of my 12 weeek sheiko the same except for tricep work, higher rep abs and 531 deadlift; before sheiko I had worked up to 480x7 in the dead at 165. I am waiting to hear back from Dave and fininsh the last 2 weks of this block of sheiko.

[Deleted]

Sometimes happens that doing Skill evaluation 3 lifts alltogeather deadlift suffers a little bit.
Just because in skill eval. you havnt got the adrenalin of the meet, and many lifters feels to have a "cooked back".
For this reason sometimes I let guys do squat and bench in day 3, and deadlift on friday. I saw that also Sheiko did it in the last Belyaev training plan.
Probebly at the meet your deadlift will rock!

[Deleted]

michael - that is something I am considering doing, switching the sheiko deadlifts to 5/31 deadlifts - I was also talking to a guy over on t-nation, and he says he does it and it works well..

adogruzza - I have not yet competed so I am unsure about that point! However, I agree that perhaps my deadlift is suffering because of doing the 3 lifts in one session. In the past when I have performed 1rms, the squat and deadlift have been on totally different days. When I tried the 95%, they were on the same day, so as you said, that could be a factor (and I also believe its a factor). Still, I do not think my deadlift has gained much on the cycle..

[Deleted]

michael - also, how did you find the 5/3/1 program? what is your preference, sheiko or 5/3/1? When dave gets back to you regarding the implementation of 5/3/1 into sheiko, please could you get back to me? Thanks

[michael]

I bought the 531 from the Elite Fitness website. Like I said I was already at the 400-600 mark for my squat and dead but what was so amazing was that I trained westside for so long on 1 rep maxes 531 was a huge switch. I enjoyed the chance to set pr's every week with different weights and not coming up short so many times waiting to peak and hit a big 1 rep max. I also miss my assistance work a little but I am more than willing to give that up for a bigger total. The only down side to 531 was form on the big 3. Human nature dictates that eventually you will sacrifice form to beat a record and this is compounded when doing 6-12 reps of squats,benches or deads. I have been competing for 12 years and lifting for 20 and I def feel as though I need to make an adjustment for my dead. I am a meet lifter meaning I don't hit big #s in training so I knew this going in but I I based my %s off 360-270-540 for my squat-bench-dead. I hit 405-270-600 in the 2 meets in 2009 and had tested 380 and 270 in the squat and bench prior to sheiko 12 week block. 540 is a weight I can open with in the dead and besides as I stated before the previous 6 months of 531 I was hitting 440-480 for 6-8 reps in the dead. When I did westside I noticed the same thing when I had to rotate squat ,gm,pull. I never made any progress until I began deadlifting every week from the floor or box. Besides that pull to the knees is very awkward at times; I am a dive bomb puller almost stiff legged as well. It can be very unnatural trying to pull to my knees and stop. Anyway I will finish soon and try to get Dave's feedback and share it with you. I have my own thoughts but I want to stay the course. One thing is for sure my quads and pecs are larger and the squat feels more confident. I am getting tired of flies though!

[Deleted]

Jan 2, 2010 9:49:03 GMT -5 @crouchmagic said:

michael - also, how did you find the 5/3/1 program? what is your preference, sheiko or 5/3/1? When dave gets back to you regarding the implementation of 5/3/1 into sheiko, please could you get back to me? Thanks

yes, that would be good to hear also.

[Deleted]

Jan 2, 2010 12:36:18 GMT -5 michael said:

I bought the 531 from the Elite Fitness website. Like I said I was already at the 400-600 mark for my squat and dead but what was so amazing was that I trained westside for so long on 1 rep maxes 531 was a huge switch. I enjoyed the chance to set pr's every week with different weights and not coming up short so many times waiting to peak and hit a big 1 rep max. I also miss my assistance work a little but I am more than willing to give that up for a bigger total. The only down side to 531 was form on the big 3. Human nature dictates that eventually you will sacrifice form to beat a record and this is compounded when doing 6-12 reps of squats,benches or deads. I have been competing for 12 years and lifting for 20 and I def feel as though I need to make an adjustment for my dead. I am a meet lifter meaning I don't hit big #s in training so I knew this going in but I I based my %s off 360-270-540 for my squat-bench-dead. I hit 405-270-600 in the 2 meets in 2009 and had tested 380 and 270 in the squat and bench prior to sheiko 12 week block. 540 is a weight I can open with in the dead and besides as I stated before the previous 6 months of 531 I was hitting 440-480 for 6-8 reps in the dead. When I did westside I noticed the same thing when I had to rotate squat ,gm,pull. I never made any progress until I began deadlifting every week from the floor or box. Besides that pull to the knees is very awkward at times; I am a dive bomb puller almost stiff legged as well. It can be very unnatural trying to pull to my knees and stop. Anyway I will finish soon and try to get Dave's feedback and share it with you. I have my own thoughts but I want to stay the course. One thing is for sure my quads and pecs are larger and the squat feels more confident. I am getting tired of flies though!

Yeh I too bought the manual from elitefts - a good read, though I think I will definitely stick with sheiko for the time being. I also find pulling to knee's akward, maybe thats because I'm very tall, who knows.

Have to agree with you on the quads and pecs getting larger, my chest has definitely grown due to the 3 times a week!

[benburgess]

Jan 2, 2010 5:20:09 GMT -5 @crouchmagic said:

Ok, I'm coming to the end of the 13 week beginner non equipped cycle, and am stuck at where to go next. I want to stay with sheiko. I keep getting told "if what you're doing is working, stick with it", however, I feel a different sheiko cycle is needed.


I have not yet completed the whole 13 weeks, so I realise I still have a fair bit of deloading to do. I'm currently around the 11th-12th week, Ive completed my 95% skills evaluation, and this is what has promoted me to start this thread.


Squat is going strong, the 95% flew up, and so I definitely think there are some decent gains to be seen when I do the real skills evaluation.

Bench also went well, however, my bench RM was not paused, and since starting sheiko, I have paused all my bench reps. Therefore, I think that the new RM will be an increase, but not as significant because I am now pausing, which is undoubtedly harder than touch and go. My 95% paused went up well.

Deadlift is where I'm unsure. My 95% went up slow, no signs of any increase, hopefully ill be able to draw a few kg's out of it but we'll see. I really think I need to do something different from 13week beginner cycle, to make it move.


So, what would you all recommend my next move be? I don't really want to approach the beginner cycle again, for the reasons regarding to deadlift. I have read that 29 is a deadlift specialisation cycle? If anyone could point me in the right direction it would be greatly appreciated.

I also contemplated about giving Wendlers 5/3/1 a shot, but after thinking about it, I'd like to stay with sheiko. I love the volume, I love the 3 days a week, and I know that volume works for me, especially in the case of squatting.

Of course, I havn't deloaded completley and tried my new 1rms, so I won't know the full extent until then, and so, I will keep this thread updated as and when those RMs come in.


Sorry for rambling, but you're the experts, and your opinion is best!

crouchmagic

Matey, I really dont think you can evaluate how well the cycle has worked or otherwise for each lift or your total at least until you have got to the meet day!

Nevermind planning what should come next. Sheiko training can be wierd with the volume and the fatigue accumulation and sometimes the skills test can feel hard and then you smash it at the meet. Sometimes vice versa.

[Deleted]

Jan 3, 2010 17:52:39 GMT -5 benburgess said:

Matey, I really dont think you can evaluate how well the cycle has worked or otherwise for each lift or your total at least until you have got to the meet day!

Nevermind planning what should come next. Sheiko training can be wierd with the volume and the fatigue accumulation and sometimes the skills test can feel hard and then you smash it at the meet. Sometimes vice versa.

Yeh I said that in my post, I kno the 95% isn't an accurate representation, but I was posting this thread now so I can keep it open for when I do my new RMs. Just to let you know, I am not competing yet so don't have any meet days! I want to compete, but wanting to get stronger first, maybe in May or August..

Lifts before Sheiko were 180,127.5,210 (in kg) weigh around 100kg..


Thanks for your reply

[benburgess]

Yeah no worries...

Well for 'meet day' read 'last day of the cycle' i.e. the time when you hit your true maxes after a deload etc.

Its not until then that you can even start to evaluate how the program worked and what to do next. Good luck with it, try to just smash it up until then and belive in what you're doing.